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View Full Version : Suicide for sale in Oregon: a “valuable service”?


rog
28 Mar 2011, 05:02 PM
By Alexandre Erler

Oregon is currently the scene of a controversy about the sale of so-called “suicide kits” or “helium hoods” (see here and here). These kits are sold by mail by a two-person company called The Gladd Group; one of its owners is reported to be a 91-year-old San Diego County woman who has been selling the kits for four years. The device is now receiving increased media attention following the suicide, with the help of the helium hood kit, of 29-year old Nick Klonoski, who had health-related issues that had brought him into depression, but was not terminally ill. His tragic death has now sparked a movement to outlaw the sale of those kits in Oregon. However, the woman selling the kits protests that she is providing a valuable service, and is quoted as saying that “[i]t is not my intention to hurt anybody, but to offer people comfort when they die”. Is the sale of those suicide kits a legitimate form of business, or should it be banned?

One thing I find disappointing about the media coverage of this issue is that the only people who are mentioned as advocating a ban on those suicide kits are opponents of assisted suicide more generally. One thus gets the impression that if you are in favour of assisted suicide, you should also be in favour of such kits being freely available for sale. After all, shouldn’t people be allowed to freely decide precisely when and how they wish to die?

I have defended assisted suicide in a previous entry on this blog, yet I believe that the sale of those suicide kits is a highly irresponsible practice and that there are good grounds for outlawing it. The problem with the sale of those kits is not that it represents a form of assisted suicide, but rather that it lacks appropriate controls. It means that the lives of vulnerable people, people who might need psychological support or other forms of help than help with dying, are being put at risk. Assisted suicide should be legal and provided not only to terminally ill people, but to every person who has expressed a clear desire to die over a sufficiently long period, who has had access to all relevant avenues of help, and whose quality of life is clearly compromised and cannot reasonably be expected to improve in the future. But that does not mean condoning the provision of assisted suicide for just anyone who requests it, including vulnerable young people going through a temporary bout of depression. Klonoski did suffer from an illness that defied medical diagnosis and diminished his quality of life, but it is not clear that he had received appropriate help to get over his depression (triggered by an onset of flu) and his associated desire to die. However that may be, the appropriate stance towards the sale of those suicide kits does not fundamentally depend on what the correct verdict is in Klonoski’s case. Whether or not he should have been helped to die, it seems quite clear that these kits are not being sold with appropriate safeguards.

Derek Humphry, the author of a best-selling book on assisted suicide and promoter of the helium hood kit, apparently doesn’t think it inappropriate for people in Klonoski’s situation to have free access to the kit, with accompanying instructions on how to use it. It is not clear, however, how we are to reconcile this with his professed wish that assisted suicide be made available to everyone who seeks it, “except the mentally disturbed, including the depressed”.

One cannot but regret that the debate on this issue should once more be characterized by a lack of nuance and involve a clash of equally implausible extreme views. Oregon, like many other American states and most countries in the world, should improve its legislation on assisted suicide, currently overly restrictive. In the meantime, it should ban the sale of suicide kits – popular singers from Marilyn Manson to Lady Gaga have been accused of romanticizing suicide, but such an unregulated aid to dying strikes me as much more dangerous.
http://blog.practicalethics.ox.ac.uk/2011/03/suicide-for-sale-in-oregon-a-%E2%80%9Cvaluable-service%E2%80%9D/#more-1314

The links from news:
http://www.cbs8.com/Global/story.asp?S=14326023
http://www.registerguard.com/web/newslocalnews/25946621-41/suicide-helium-humphry-kit-klonoski.html.csp

trendkill
01 Apr 2011, 03:15 AM
The problem with the sale of those kits is not that it represents a form of assisted suicide, but rather that it lacks appropriate controls.Yes, I can see how this could be a problem if you want to control other people. I find the view that it is our responsibility to control other peoples' lives for their own good far more dangerous than anything like these suicide kits could ever be.

DanB
01 Apr 2011, 03:32 AM
Perhaps a business opportunity here? A competing kit which includes a sharp knife and a neck template. Helium is expensive and our supplies are dwindling!

Roo St. Gallus
01 Apr 2011, 05:06 AM
Hmmm...I'm in Oregon, and I haven't heard boo about this Konoski case. It's not a big surprise, though. It hasn't hit local news here in the big city. People will seek out ways to off themselves. If they are serious, they will actually carry it out. Making illegal is a bit silly, though...I mean, are they going to prosecute the suicide victim? No...they want to stop the person marketing the knowledge and materials to them.

Rather than legislating the result, why don't we provide resources to treat the causes?

I found this to be a bit odd:

Oregon, like many other American states and most countries in the world, should improve its legislation on assisted suicide, currently overly restrictive.

considering Oregon was the first state, and the first political district, worldwide, to legalize physician-assisted suicide for the terminally ill. I voted for it, twice, since it was an initiative ballot issue twice, thanks to John Ashcroft. So did an overwhelming majority of the voters in the state. I did so because I was satisfied with the protections the law provided for the physicians and pharmacists involved, and from the potential predators who might abuse the law to their own ends.

Then, I had my dearest loved one invoke that law upon her impending death.

Because of the protections, she never got to actually use the law. She died before the fourteen day waiting period expired. But she told me that it made her feel better that she had that power within her grasp.

Suicide is no laughing matter. It it not to be taken lightly or easily provided. Some people do need controls to protect them. Others will find ways regardless of all the laws you might want to legislate and attempt to enforce. Why give it any media at all?

Monad
01 Apr 2011, 07:46 AM
How could it be legal in the first place? It's basically a murder kit - if your old granny with dementia is getting too much of a burden pop one of these on her head and say she asked you for relief. Where is the oversight?

Ozymandias
01 Apr 2011, 10:54 AM
How could it be legal in the first place? It's basically a murder kit - if your old granny with dementia is getting too much of a burden pop one of these on her head and say she asked you for relief. Where is the oversight?

It doesn't matter what you say afterwards, it would still be murder and you would still go to prison as surely as if you had given her a drug overdose.

Personally, I quite like the idea of these kits. But I think they should be regulated to make sure that they work as advertised, and kill you in an efficient, easy and pain-free way.

dancer_rnb
01 Apr 2011, 02:52 PM
How could it be legal in the first place? It's basically a murder kit - if your old granny with dementia is getting too much of a burden pop one of these on her head and say she asked you for relief. Where is the oversight?

It doesn't matter what you say afterwards, it would still be murder and you would still go to prison as surely as if you had given her a drug overdose.

Personally, I quite like the idea of these kits. But I think they should be regulated to make sure that they work as advertised, and kill you in an efficient, easy and pain-free way.

I lost both my parents to a double suicide. If it would have been possible for my mom to kill herself (due to horrible diabetes complications) I likely would only have lost one of them.

One other problem with the restrictions on dementia is what if you are lucid part of the time, and want to kill yourself then? (I saw this)

Berthold
07 Apr 2011, 03:17 PM
Helium is expensive and our supplies are dwindling!
*As a purely technical information:*

Pure nitrogen works likewise, and is painless, too.

Loren Pechtel
07 Apr 2011, 04:30 PM
Helium is expensive and our supplies are dwindling!
*As a purely technical information:*

Pure nitrogen works likewise, and is painless, too.

Yeah. The only reason people use helium is that it's a consumer product. Nitrogen is not. I would have no problem obtaining a tank of helium--I've seen them for sale more than once. While I have driven past a place that sells nitrogen it would come in tanks that I probably couldn't handle and I'm not at all sure I could even transport in my car.

Furthermore, while nitrogen will cost far less per cubic foot of gas it's normally packed in far more expensive containers than consumer helium comes in. For a single-use situation the helium is going to be cheaper.

The weight problem could be gotten around with LN2 but that introduces it's own handling headaches as you don't have a convenient flow control valve and a mistake with it might end up shattering your containment, not to mention what would happen to you if you spilled any of it on yourself.

Berthold
07 Apr 2011, 05:17 PM
There are lecture bottles (http://www.intergas.co.uk/lecturebottles.html) for nearly anything.

ApostateAbe
07 Apr 2011, 08:09 PM
Suicide is a disaster for all living relatives. I strongly value the freedom of people to do with their own lives as they see fit, however, and nobody should control that. A helium-induced death is considerably less traumatic, in my opinion, than so many other methods of suicide.

Loren Pechtel
08 Apr 2011, 07:12 PM
Suicide is a disaster for all living relatives

Not always. I know someone who committed suicide for medical reasons. The relatives that knew understood why, it wasn't a disaster.

Lurkalot
08 Apr 2011, 10:35 PM
Pure nitrogen works likewise, and is painless, too.

How does this differ from the pain of simply holding breath too long ?

rog
08 Apr 2011, 10:38 PM
Pure nitrogen works likewise, and is painless, too.

How does this differ from the pain of simply holding breath too long ?

They say it's a euphoric feeling, oxygen deprivation is not supposed to be painful.

Lurkalot
08 Apr 2011, 10:58 PM
So the pain comes from build up of co2 ?

DanB
08 Apr 2011, 10:59 PM
Pure nitrogen works likewise, and is painless, too.

How does this differ from the pain of simply holding breath too long ?

They say it's a euphoric feeling, oxygen deprivation is not supposed to be painful.If, I'm not mistaken, the pain of suffocation is due to a reaction to CO2 build up in the lungs.

Loren Pechtel
09 Apr 2011, 07:59 PM
Pure nitrogen works likewise, and is painless, too.

How does this differ from the pain of simply holding breath too long ?

There's no pain. The thing is our breathing reflex is tied to the buildup of CO2 rather than the absence of oxygen. We don't notice the absence of oxygen at all.