Chimps make tools

[David B]

It's one thing for an animal to use a stick or a rock or something as a tool

Another thing to modify it, to make it more effective.

The only creatures I knew of before today that modify their tools were humans and some east indian crow.

But apparently chimps do, too.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/7922120.stm

David B

[Goldie]

I've seen this and find it extremely interesting. If I didn't havea family, I'd be off studying with Jane Goodall.

I don't think we give our primate cousins nearly enough credit.

[Jobar]

Apparently, different troupes of chimps specialize in different tools; some troupes don't appear to use any tools at all, while others may make multiple stone and wood implements to help them 'fish' for termites, crack nuts, or groom themselves and each other. Tool use is obviously a learned and not an instinctive behavior.

[Hex]

Absolutely.

It's been an on-going study with anthropologists (the particular subsets are primatology and behavioral ecology). The fact that these different tool uses are passed from generation to generation in those different areas, and that chimps who migrate from one group to another can introduce new tools to their new group have been heralded by some as indications of culture.

I side on the more conservative end of this, in looking at them having 'proto-culture', since they don't have as much in terms of communication, and that's a big part of what we look at as culture. But it was after Jane Goodall's first couple of field seasons that they (prompted by Louis Leaky's arguments) dropped 'tool use' from the definition of 'homo sapiens sapiens' ...

[Oolon Colluphid]

I've seen film of chimps fishing for termites -- stripping leaves etc to make the stick just right for the job -- before. I suppose it oughtn't be all that surprising, but seeing a 'mere animal' do something so 'human' certainly strips away our preconceptions.

[Mung Dynasty]

Aint we basically chimps? Sorta mutated and gone a tad bald, but basically chimps nonetheless.

[Cath B]

A couple of years ago I went to a talk by Andrew Whiten (http://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/psychology/people/lect/aw2.shtml) about chimp "culture". He had been coordinating info about recorded techniques of food gathering and tool use (and manufacture) from chimps in different areas. The results appeared consistent with cultural variation.

I've booked in to see him again at the Edinburgh Science Festival next month.

http://www.sciencefestival.co.uk/Events/Talking-Science/Culture-Evolves-in-the-Animal-World

[Cath B]

I remember years ago seeing a talk by Steven Mithen (http://www.reading.ac.uk/archaeology/about/staff/s-j-mithen.asp) where he reckoned that chimps allow juveniles to observe them making tools but, unlike humans, do not attempt to teach directly.

[Cath B]

Dave, wasn't there something about chimps modifying tools in Through A Window: Thirty Years with the Chimpanzees of Gombe (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Through-Window-Thirty-Years-Chimpanzees/dp/0753810212/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1236246445&sr=8-1) by Jene Goodall which I gave you as a present a few years back?

[David B]

Dave, wasn't there something about chimps modifying tools in Through A Window: Thirty Years with the Chimpanzees of Gombe (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Through-Window-Thirty-Years-Chimpanzees/dp/0753810212/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1236246445&sr=8-1) by Jene Goodall which I gave you as a present a few years back?

If so, I had forgotten, or speed read through it.

[Ray Moscow]

I thought this had been known for some years (even though it's fascinating anyway).

[Cath B]

But it was after Jane Goodall's first couple of field seasons that they (prompted by Louis Leaky's arguments) dropped 'tool use' from the definition of 'homo sapiens sapiens' ...

"Now we must redefine tool, redefine man, or accept chimpanzees as human." (Louis Leakey)

[Brother Daniel]

Aint we basically chimps? Sorta mutated and gone a tad bald, but basically chimps nonetheless.
With some neoteny. If we weren't so damned dangerous, the chimps would probably look at us and say "oh, they're so cute!".

[Goldie]

I thought this had been known for some years (even though it's fascinating anyway).

I think it's the fact that they modify the stick, thereby making the tool that is "new."

Or that they've proved it.:dunno: