Getting rid of a yellowjacket (wasp) nest in the ground

[crazyfingers]

I've got a hazardous mission to accomplish. It appears that a mole hole right by the house by the deck and the AC unit has got a large yellow jacket nest inside.

http://home.comcast.net/~mjdude/pwpimages/IMG_1676a.jpg

http://home.comcast.net/~mjdude/pwpimages/IMG_1678a.jpg

I assume that it's large because there are multiple going in and out all the time.

Has anyone tried to get rid of one of these? I see most advice in the net recommends using insecticide power instead of one of those sprays that shoot 20 feet. But I went down to the hardware store and they only have the sprays.

I plan to do it at night. I have a full-body bug net that I have for camping. Pants, shirt and head net.

Does anyone know if I should really get the powder?

One interesting suggestion I found on the net was to get out my shop-vac and place the nozzle down by the hole and let it run all day..... Not sure I like that idea but it is an interesting suggestion.

[David B]

Trouble with insecticides is that they are poisonous.

As a first attempt I'd suggest what one of my friends did with an ants nest just outside her front door.

Kettles of boiling water.

Suit still good idea.

David

[Cath B]

I'm not sure about the life cycle of these wasps in Massachusetts, but in the UK wasps mostly die off during the autumn though they are more likely to sting towards the end of their life cycle. We had a wasps next in the eaves of the house a few years ago. The wasps were a bit of a pest for a while and most or all of the family was stung once or twice. Once they died off my husband removed the nest and had a good look round for overwintering queens but found none. The following year we had no more trouble.

I'm pretty sure my husband once removed a wasp nest found earlier in the year from te garden once but can't remember how he did it. He also smoked a bees nest to quieten them and took it away in a wooden box to the woods without getting stung. He kitted himself out with a mask and protective clothing first.

[willynilly]

Peppermint oil in soapy water recommended online as a natural killer. Also aerosol hairspray.

[Goldie]

We have tons of issues with hornets/wasps/yellowjackets.

My husband says do it in the very early morning, when you can see but they are still cold and asleep. (Is is cold in the AM where you are?)
We usually don't have the ground nests except in the woods. We have to use the sprays...but they have them now that foam so the hornets can't fly out, they die pretty-much instantly and you don't have to use much.
He says to try just plugging it off, but look around in a 5' area to make sure they don't have an escape hatch. Just plugging them off can sometimes do it. He has done this with large, paper nests successfully.
If the hole is big enough to close off with a glass bottle or jar, use that so you can watch them try to fly out....see of they are flying out elsewhere after that. Boiling water should work as well as anything, but you should make sure that they don't have another way out.

We deal with many near our home on a constant basis. A nest doesn't have to be huge to be home to many yellow jackets.
Just be very careful.

[VenDexter]

Has anyone tried to get rid of one of these? I see most advice in the net recommends using insecticide power instead of one of those sprays that shoot 20 feet. But I went down to the hardware store and they only have the sprays.

I plan to do it at night. I have a full-body bug net that I have for camping. Pants, shirt and head net.

Does anyone know if I should really get the powder?

One interesting suggestion I found on the net was to get out my shop-vac and place the nozzle down by the hole and let it run all day..... Not sure I like that idea but it is an interesting suggestion.

Yellow jackets are extremely aggressive this time of year. Be extra vigilant that you don't have any openings in the bug suit. Make sure you have on a heavy cotton long sleeve shirt and heavy cotton/denim pants underneath. Make sure they are loose fitting as well. Also gloves will be a great idea to help protect your hands. If they come at you en masse, retreat and come back later when they've calmed a bit.

There have been reported deaths related to the mass stinging that a large nest of yellow jackets can dole out but those are mainly related to the very young or elderly or those allergic. If you're none of these it's usually not problem - just a heads up.

The powder will work a bit more slowly but will be the most effective since they will carry it into the nest and spread it around but the spray will be more immediate. Another good alternative is to mix up a solution of liquid laundry detergent (Tide seems to work really well) and water and pour it into the hole. It will break the surface tension of the water allowing it to enter their spiracles and drown them immediately. It's one of the most common ways that killer bees are controlled but it may kill the grass in the area though.

Good luck with this one. Another heads up is make sure you don't mow the lawn near the nest until they have been gotten rid of. They respond the vibration from machinery as though it's an invasion and will send out the troops to try and fend off the mower and you.

Don't do the Shop-Vac route! You'll have a vacuum full of pissed off yellow jackets to deal with!

[Monad]

Get really really close and pee on it :evil:

[Christina]

I've accidentally watered those a few times and have gotten numerous stings out of it. Joe uses the spray but I've also used boiling hot bleach water at dawn and it worked.

[crazyfingers]

Trouble with insecticides is that they are poisonous.

As a first attempt I'd suggest what one of my friends did with an ants nest just outside her front door.

Kettles of boiling water.

Suit still good idea.

David

Not sure I want to go the water route. I don't know the shape of the tunnel and water could easily just flow under the actual nest. It's sure not going to kill them all at once and I really don't want them coming at me.

I'm not sure about the life cycle of these wasps in Massachusetts, but in the UK wasps mostly die off during the autumn though they are more likely to sting towards the end of their life cycle.

Yes now is when they will be most aggressive. Trouble is that the kids need to play out there and the cats are also around out there. And I need to mow the area. (I'm surprised that I haven't been stung yet having mowed by their nest, though not actually over it,) It's right by the deck. I'm a bit surprised that they chose that spot as it's right next to the concrete slab that the AC unit sits on. I suppose that they must have established the nest in the spring before the AC started to go on. It must be making them real mad all the time.

I don't want to wait for them to just die off naturally in the cold weather. Too long to wait.

We have tons of issues with hornets/wasps/yellowjackets.

My husband says do it in the very early morning, when you can see but they are still cold and asleep.


It appears that yellow jackets can't see red light. What I've read on the internet suggests using a red flashlight, the kind I use outside with my telescope to preserve my night vision. I will see them but they can't see me.


(Is is cold in the AM where you are?)


It's not going to be cold or even chilly at night for several weeks.


He says to try just plugging it off, but look around in a 5' area to make sure they don't have an escape hatch. Just plugging them off can sometimes do it. He has done this with large, paper nests successfully. If the hole is big enough to close off with a glass bottle or jar, use that so you can watch them try to fly out....see of they are flying out elsewhere after that. Boiling water should work as well as anything, but you should make sure that they don't have another way out.

I don't think that they have another way out. I've been looking around today. I suspect that they would have had a second way out had I not dropped a bunch of rocks down the other mole hole 4 feet away this past spring.

I do plan to drop a nice rock on the hole once I've sprayed down it.


Just be very careful.

Careful is right! I intend to be 100% sting proof inside my bug suit. No cracks or places where the net touches any place they can sting though.



Yellow jackets are extremely aggressive this time of year. Be extra vigilant that you don't have any openings in the bug suit. Make sure you have on a heavy cotton long sleeve shirt and heavy cotton/denim pants underneath. Make sure they are loose fitting as well. Also gloves will be a great idea to help protect your hands. If they come at you en masse, retreat and come back later when they've calmed a bit.

There have been reported deaths related to the mass stinging that a large nest of yellow jackets can dole out but those are mainly related to the very young or elderly or those allergic. If you're none of these it's usually not problem - just a heads up.

The powder will work a bit more slowly but will be the most effective since they will carry it into the nest and spread it around but the spray will be more immediate. Another good alternative is to mix up a solution of liquid laundry detergent (Tide seems to work really well) and water and pour it into the hole. It will break the surface tension of the water allowing it to enter their spiracles and drown them immediately. It's one of the most common ways that killer bees are controlled but it may kill the grass in the area though.

Good luck with this one. Another heads up is make sure you don't mow the lawn near the nest until they have been gotten rid of. They respond the vibration from machinery as though it's an invasion and will send out the troops to try and fend off the mower and you.

I'm surprised that they haven't attacked me yet. I've mowed the grass within 3 inches of the opening at least 10 times this summer. And the vibration from the AC unit must keep them pissed off all the time.


Don't do the Shop-Vac route! You'll have a vacuum full of pissed off yellow jackets to deal with!

Don't worry. I'm not going to try that. It's just amusing to think about.

[Monad]

Can't you get something like that ant nest killer bait that their workers will eat and take back to the nest and then it works its way through the whole nest? It's very effective for ants and I would expect something similar would work for wasps too without requiring a direct assault on the nest?

[crazyfingers]

Can't you get something like that ant nest killer bait that their workers will eat and take back to the nest and then it works its way through the whole nest? It's very effective for ants and I would expect something similar would work for wasps too without requiring a direct assault on the nest?

I don't know but they don't sell anything like that in the store. At least not at the ACE hardware store and the Home Depot I visited today. I don't know what they would make it out of. These wasps eat other insects mainly.

[David B]

Not sure I want to go the water route. I don't know the shape of the tunnel and water could easily just flow under the actual nest. It's sure not going to kill them all at once and I really don't want them coming at me.

Wear suit anyway, and do it at dawn, as others have suggested.

Check for other exits, and if there are any, block them.

Shove a funnel, or the cut off top of a large fizzy drink bottle, spout down, into the opening.

Use multiple kettles and/or saucepans, putting the first couple you use back on when you get the next lot.

Boiling water will kill lots of stuff, but won't get things with lots of poison in them getting to the surface and getting eaten by birds, or otherwise entering the food chain.

If it don't work, what have you lost?

David

[Ray Moscow]

Personally I'd go with a long-distance insecticide spray.

The wasps here are not usually so aggressive as those in the US. I got stung frequently growing up in the US south.

[David B]

Personally I'd go with a long-distance insecticide spray.

The wasps here are not usually so aggressive as those in the US. I got stung frequently growing up in the US south.

You know more about this sort of stuff than me.

Is there a downside to wasps killed by dying as a result of such a spray getting eaten by birds, or things that birds eat?

I wouldn't do it, just in case, but I don't know.

David

[Ray Moscow]

It's not so likely that they'll get eaten right away, since the sprays are pretty nasty smelling (and presumably tasting).

Sprays -- or dousing them with petrol or a solvent -- are about the only ways to kill them without getting stung, sometimes many times. Sometimes one can just leave them alone, but if they are in an area where you or your family have to be, one has to do something.

[rlogan]

I have to contend with these a lot in the woods.

A sting or three is OK but if I have to kill a nest to do something important, then I use the foam spray that goes 20 ft.

It foams over the opening to shut it off so none get out. Stay on it though - keep foaming it closed every few minutes.

Come back a while later and there will be a bunch there that were out to the flowers. Easy to get them with a glop of spray.



Y'now I am probably the world record killer on this site, but I don't even like to kill these things and avoid it as much as possible.

There's no joy in killing wasps or yellow jackets. If one is stinging me then yea, no problem slapping him.



Also I have a theory from what I have observed: Whenever I am with someone else, they panic. Swing at them violently and run. Usually they get stung and I don't. I think there is something to this. Not sure what, but I try to be really calm and economize on movement.

[David B]

It's not so likely that they'll get eaten right away, since the sprays are pretty nasty smelling (and presumably tasting).

Sprays -- or dousing them with petrol or a solvent -- are about the only ways to kill them without getting stung, sometimes many times. Sometimes one can just leave them alone, but if they are in an area where you or your family have to be, one has to do something.

My suggestion wouldn't work? Depending perhaps on the underground topography, but work enough to make it worth a shot?

David

[Ray Moscow]

I thought they can burrow and presumably dig themselves out. But if you are able to kill them in the process, it could work.

[David B]

I thought they can burrow and presumably dig themselves out. But if you are able to kill them in the process, it could work.

I'd have thought that if you manage to boil the queen, then their raison d'etre for being there would go away.

David

[crazyfingers]

Is there a downside to wasps killed by dying as a result of such a spray getting eaten by birds, or things that birds eat?



David

In this case, since the nest is in a hole in the ground, no birds will be getting the dead wasps. At most the worms will stay away until the stuff breaks down.

[crazyfingers]

Y'now I am probably the world record killer on this site, but I don't even like to kill these things and avoid it as much as possible.

There's no joy in killing wasps or yellow jackets. If one is stinging me then yea, no problem slapping him.



If the nest was in the woods I would leave them alone. Overall they are good bugs because they eat pest bugs. But they are right next to the house on the lawn where the kids play and just below the deck.

[crazyfingers]

My suggestion wouldn't work? Depending perhaps on the underground topography, but work enough to make it worth a shot?

David

I'm personally not too keen on trying something that could easily just end up just pissing off the whole nest and them coming out after me even in my bug suit.

[David B]

My suggestion wouldn't work? Depending perhaps on the underground topography, but work enough to make it worth a shot?

David

I'm personally not too keen on trying something that could easily just end up just pissing off the whole nest and them coming out after me even in my bug suit.

Not likely, if you have the hole blocked by a funnel. You'd be unlucky to get one finding its way out.

David

[Garnet]

Pour some gas down in'nere and light it a'fire. That'll kill the little bastards.

[/redneck]

[David B]

Pour some gas down in'nere and light it a'fire. That'll kill the little bastards.

[/redneck]

Might not be enough oxygen to maintain the fire.

David

[Jobar]

Pour some gas down in'nere and light it a'fire. That'll kill the little bastards.

[/redneck]

Don't set it on fire. Instead, take a pint of gasoline and pour it straight down the hole, after dark. No funnel needed. In fact, if you're careful and don't let the one or two soldiers left on guard at the opening see a light close enough to attack, you won't even need your suit; I've killed plenty of them with just jeans and a t-shirt on. The trick is hitting the hole with the poured stream right away.

Boiling water may not work if the tunnel is long enough- and I've seen them more than 6 ft. long! Gasoline, diesel fuel, or even alcohol will work, because the vapors from it are heavier than air, and will seep downwards and asphyxiate the entire nest before they can dig their way out.

Rlogan's method will work too, but doing it in the daytime puts you at risk of being attacked by ones which are coming back to the nest; at night you get them all with minimal fuss.

[Garnet]

By the way...I WAS KIDDING!

Sheesh.

[Jobar]

I wasn't.
:D

[Garnet]

I wasn't.
:D

:evil:

[Jobar]

Reminds me of this thread (http://www.secularcafe.org/showthread.php?p=47990&#post47990) a couple of months ago.

A couple of weeks ago I was outside when I heard a cicada in the cane brake beside my house start making the damndest noise- way different from their usual loud buzz/hum. When I went to investigate, it was being attacked by an Asian hornet! One hell of a battle, even though the cicada was twice the size of the hornet. I quickly went in my house and got some bug spray, and doused the hornet. It had already killed the cicada.

[crazyfingers]

Mission completed - for tonight - and hopefully for good.

It's 9:00pm and very dark. I just sprayed 3 cans of hornet and Wasp killer down the hole and then sealed the hole with a rock.

It's still 75 degrees and very humid outside. My suit really got hot. But I never heard or saw one wasp.

Will have to take a look outside tomorrow morning before work but I expect that we'll keep the kids away for a day just so that I can inspect for any sneak back door that I didn't see today.

http://home.comcast.net/~mjdude/pwpimages/IMG_1687a.jpg

[crazyfingers]

Reminds me of this thread (http://www.secularcafe.org/showthread.php?p=47990&#post47990) a couple of months ago.
When I went to investigate, it was being attacked by an Asian hornet!

I hope that your Asian Hornet wasn't an Asian Giant Hornet in Georgia!

Where there's one there are millions.

[Garrett]

A sting or three is OK but if I have to kill a nest to do something important, then I use the foam spray that goes 20 ft.
I deal with the critters at work routinely, and couldn't do it without that foam spray. Once in a while the can fails, so I always bring two.

Y'now I am probably the world record killer on this site, but I don't even like to kill these things and avoid it as much as possible.

There's no joy in killing wasps or yellow jackets.
That's why I'm responding, because I feel similar. I've got to get them off the porches of these retired people, though. I found one large nest this year, bigger than a football. The structure of their nest reminded me of Zion in the Matrix. It took multiple assaults, spread over hours, to get at the inner sections. As I later broke the nest down with a handle, there were temporary survivors deep inside. It broke my heart.

[crazyfingers]

I called my dad earlier today just to ask if he had ever had to get rid of a yellow jacket hive. Only once and he failed. Like mine, it was a hive in a hole in the ground. He tried drowning them out with the garden hose. He tried spraying with his "fogger". He tried powder. Nothing worked.

Then one morning he went out and the hive was gone. A skunk had come by at night, dug it out and threw it all over the yard.

That was a good 30 years ago.

[Thalia Thinks]

I know it's not "green" but I'm all for the gas thing.

I have used it my whole life. They die instantly, no chance of stinging you at all. Even the fumes will kill them if you don't touch them with it right away.

[Goldie]

I agree the foam spray is best.
We have such problems here with them. Every week I find new nests being built around the place. It was even worse when we lived up north.
I have been stung muliple times this year and that is how I found a few of the nests.

[Jobar]

Once I was mowing a yard around a house which had major reconstruction going on, and the owner ran out of money. There were several sheets of old plywood lying on the ground around it- and yellow jackets had built a nest under one end of one sheet, with the only tunnel coming out the other end.

One of my helpers made the mistake of walking across that plywood; luckily he saw them coming out right away, and fled before they attacked him. To get rid of them I finally had to pour gas all around that sheet!

I need to get me an outfit like that one, cf.

And yeah, there are, definitely, Asian hornets in Georgia. I'm pretty sure the decrease in our honeybee population may be directly related... :(

[crazyfingers]

I need to get me an outfit like that one, cf.

I got it for camping in Canada when we were attacked by black flies. Used it the next trip too.



And yeah, there are, definitely, Asian hornets in Georgia. I'm pretty sure the decrease in our honeybee population may be directly related... :(

I was hoping that you wouldn't say that. I know about the honeybee problem and was wondering about that. The bee scientists still seem so confused. :(

[Goldie]

My husband and his crew get attacked pretty regularly in the woods this time of year.
They can be extremely nasty right about now.

[Jobar]

What with the milder winters brought on by global warming, we aren't seeing the wintertime die-offs of insects like the yellow jacket. I saw last year where the biggest nest ever found was in the back of an old car in a barn- let's see if I can google it...
http://thegrip.wordpress.com/2008/10/17/biggest-yellow-jacket-nest-ever/
(Warning- don't click on that if this sort of stuff freaks you out. Scary!)

[Ray Moscow]

Note the difference between those experienced with yellow jackets (kill them from a distance!) vs those who aren't (get close and try something to see whether it works).

You get close to the nest, and you'll probably get stung, repeatedly. At least, that was my experience.

[willynilly]

What with the milder winters brought on by global warming, we aren't seeing the wintertime die-offs of insects like the yellow jacket. I saw last year where the biggest nest ever found was in the back of an old car in a barn- let's see if I can google it...
http://thegrip.wordpress.com/2008/10/17/biggest-yellow-jacket-nest-ever/
(Warning- don't click on that if this sort of stuff freaks you out. Scary!)

That is really scary and amazing at the same time.

[crazyfingers]

UPDATE: So I went out on the deck this morning and looked down at the hive and rock. There were 6-8 wasps flying around the rock. I sprayed them from above.

More came. I kept spraying them.

I probably got 50-60 of them before I left for work. I didn't see any come out of the hole that the rock is on. These were coming from somewhere and trying to get in. Is it possible that a bunch of them didn't make it back last night before it got dark?

[Faerie]

Scary creatures. We've got wasps here, but they're a bunch of wussies in comparison...:(

[Ray Moscow]

As the average nest might have 4000 or 5000 wasps, you probably just declared war on an oppressed and angry people. ;)

[crazyfingers]

Hmmm

[Faerie]

As the average nest might have 4000 or 5000 wasps, you probably just declared war on an oppressed and angry people. ;)

who's equipped and experienced with biological weapons and obsessed with home-land security ;)

[Jobar]

Hate to say it, but it sounds like the tunnel to the actual nest was long enough that they weren't killed by the spray. You need to look around very carefully to see if they have an alternate entrance, and are coming out of that and investigating the main one.

Another bad thing about yellowjackets is that they'll find another hole somewhere and move to it if they're sufficiently disturbed. If you didn't kill them, by the end of the day I suspect they'll start moving out.

If all activity around the tunnel mouth ceases, you might try digging back to the nest and making sure it's dead. Usually it isn't very deep- though you may have to dig a small trench to find it.

[Matty]

hit it up with a pressure washer. Done that on two different nests one hanging, one kind half buried by the side of the shed and the PW took both the fuck down. Like disintegrated it.

PLus any wasps that did venture out copped a firehosing and were easy to kill whilst they wriggled on the deck after a solid dousing.

[diana]

http://thegrip.wordpress.com/2008/10/17/biggest-yellow-jacket-nest-ever/
(Warning- don't click on that if this sort of stuff freaks you out. Scary!)Holymarymotherofgod. How would you begin to solve that problem?

Jesus. I think I'd just move.

d

[Ray Moscow]

Call the Orkin man!

[Puck]

*looks askance at the bug suit*

You know, they can sting through that, right? If any of the netting is against your skin, it won't work.

Ray or Thalia are spot on. Either have a profession cope with them, or resort to pouring some gas down there.

[Comassion]

http://thegrip.wordpress.com/2008/10/17/biggest-yellow-jacket-nest-ever/
(Warning- don't click on that if this sort of stuff freaks you out. Scary!)Holymarymotherofgod. How would you begin to solve that problem?

Jesus. I think I'd just move.

d

Call a towtruck and be prepared to tip well.

[crazyfingers]

*looks askance at the bug suit*

You know, they can sting through that, right? If any of the netting is against your skin, it won't work.

None was against my skin.

[crazyfingers]

UPDATE II

I found a small back door. Very small hole. One bee at a time. The volume of traffic is far lower than the first hole. It's well under the deck which is gated off as the kids are not allowed under the deck. But the cats do go by there sometimes.

I'm wondering if I should wait for them to enlarge the hole or even ignore it. As it is, I couldn't get 1/2 the contents of a can down that hole. Too small.

I'm thinking that for the time being I should just keep an eye on it? We'll be going away for a week starting Friday on vacation but the cats will be staying here.

Would there be any real danger to the cats? I suppose I could put a box open at the top and bottom, around the hole to keep the cats from accidentally stepping on it.

[Goldie]

Can't you just plug it off?

[crazyfingers]

Can't you just plug it off?

I think that they would just dig themselves out in a day. Not sure though.

[Goldie]

You might try spraying into both ends with the foam and plugging the holes with bottles or something long. This might take away their oxygen. Might be worth a try. Either way, if they are that close to your home, you need to get rid of them, even if it means calling someone.
It's a never ending battle here, but not as bad as last year. We had a a very cold winter with record snow and it killed off a lot of them, thank goodness.

[crazyfingers]

You might try spraying into both ends with the foam and plugging the holes with bottles or something long. This might take away their oxygen. Might be worth a try. Either way, if they are that close to your home, you need to get rid of them, even if it means calling someone.
It's a never ending battle here, but not as bad as last year. We had a a very cold winter with record snow and it killed off a lot of them, thank goodness.

The big hole that was on the edge of the lawn is plugged and I suspect that a lot were killed off with the spray.

The little hole far under the deck where the kids aren't allowed seems to have far less traffic. Instead of 4-6 comings and going all the time it's 15 second between a come or a go of a single bee. That might just be that there isn't room for more than one at a time in the tunnel but... wouldn't they be outside making the hole bigger if there were more than a few left??

I don't know. Just looking for opinions. But, since we are going away in three days for a week vacation, I'm tempted to wait until labor day to decide much more. But I'll keep an eye on the hole in any case. If they do enlarge it and activity increases I will likely do something before we leave.

[crazyfingers]

I have a second nest. Completely unrelated to the first, it's in the rhododendron bush and a bit larger than a football, about 3 feet off the ground. Something attacked it as there are parts of it lying on the ground but they are going in and out so it's still functioning. Grrr. Maybe the hurricane that's due to arrive Saturday (and delay my vacation :mad: ) will knock it down....

As for the first one in the ground, they still haven't enlarged the back door hole. Just checked it in the dark. One wasp guarding the opening and it's only large enough for one at a time up and down.

[Goldie]

Kill them ASAP. Foaming spray will kill the one hanging. Cover it inside and out.
The more you let live the more you'll have. The problem will only get worse.

Sorry.

[crazyfingers]

Kill them ASAP. Foaming spray will kill the one hanging. Cover it inside and out.
The more you let live the more you'll have. The problem will only get worse.

Sorry.

You're probably right. I have Friday off and it looks like we will be delaying vacation until the hurricane passes Saturday night.

So I could go out Friday night and spray it, cut it down, and throw it in a trash bag.

[Goldie]

That sounds like a good sized nest. Not cool near your house. Again...the gramma in me want's to say, "Be careful!" :o

[Jobar]

I have a second nest. Completely unrelated to the first, it's in the rhododendron bush and a bit larger than a football, about 3 feet off the ground. Something attacked it as there are parts of it lying on the ground but they are going in and out so it's still functioning. Grrr. Maybe the hurricane that's due to arrive Saturday (and delay my vacation :mad: ) will knock it down....

As for the first one in the ground, they still haven't enlarged the back door hole. Just checked it in the dark. One wasp guarding the opening and it's only large enough for one at a time up and down.

Those aren't yellowjackets- hornets maybe, or red wasps, or guinea wasps, or one of several other wasp species that live in the US. Yellowjackets build underground, or sometimes inside structures like rock walls (or old cars, obviously.) They won't build a nest out in the open, not that I've ever seen.

Tell me, would you happen to have a Coleman-style white gas camp stove, with the removable gas tank? If you do, you can use that as an applicator- fill it full and hold it at an angle other than the one it's designed to operate at, and the gasoline squirts out in a very tight high-pressure stream, that will go ten feet or more. I've used one to deal with nests in difficult-to-reach places.

I dealt with a yellowjacket nest here at my place, last night right after dark. As I suggested, a pint or two of gas, right down the hole. I wore jeans and a t-shirt, and never even heard one come close.

I may have a much larger problem, though. The tree from which my cable swing hangs-
http://gallery.ensignsteve.com/gallery/20070518/IMG_1533
-is hollow, and in the afternoon, before I zapped that yellowjacket nest, I saw half a dozen Asian hornets investigating it closely. They appeared to be looking for a way to get into the hollow- and they nest in hollow trees.

If they decide to do that, I have a really serious problem! Access to the hollow is high on the river side of the tree, and barring bringing in a bucket truck that would reach out over the water, I have no idea how I'd reach a nest of hornets safely- even then I'd need a suit as good as yours, or better.

[crazyfingers]

Those aren't yellowjackets- hornets maybe, or red wasps, or guinea wasps, or one of several other wasp species that live in the US. Yellowjackets build underground, or sometimes inside structures like rock walls (or old cars, obviously.) They won't build a nest out in the open, not that I've ever seen.

Ya I was wondering about that. I haven't gotten a good look at the critters yet.



Tell me, would you happen to have a Coleman-style white gas camp stove, with the removable gas tank? If you do, you can use that as an applicator- fill it full and hold it at an angle other than the one it's designed to operate at, and the gasoline squirts out in a very tight high-pressure stream, that will go ten feet or more. I've used one to deal with nests in difficult-to-reach places.

I don't. I have several of the coleman Peak1 stoves that look similar to the Apollo lunar lander. You know the stove I expect.

This nest shouldn't be that hard to get at. I strongly suspect that it's been partly torn open on the back side facing inside the bush. When I was out mowing yesterday, when I first spotted this new nest, there was a large outer layer on the ground almost the size of one side of the nest. I think that I can get the spray into that open face OK. But it will mean going around the back of the bush in the evening with my bug suit on.

I dealt with a yellowjacket nest here at my place, last night right after dark. As I suggested, a pint or two of gas, right down the hole. I wore jeans and a t-shirt, and never even heard one come close.

I may be that bold when I deal with the back door to my first nest.



I may have a much larger problem, though. The tree from which my cable swing hangs-
http://gallery.ensignsteve.com/gallery/20070518/IMG_1533
-is hollow, and in the afternoon, before I zapped that yellowjacket nest, I saw half a dozen Asian hornets investigating it closely. They appeared to be looking for a way to get into the hollow- and they nest in hollow trees.

If they decide to do that, I have a really serious problem! Access to the hollow is high on the river side of the tree, and barring bringing in a bucket truck that would reach out over the water, I have no idea how I'd reach a nest of hornets safely- even then I'd need a suit as good as yours, or better.

That sounds like a problem. Here it gets very cold in the winter and they would just die off. I take it that they don't die off in Georgia?

[Goldie]

Jobar,
See this wiki page on yellow jackets. Their nests DO hang. Certainly their are different types but what we call yellow jackets DO make hanging nests. I see them all of the time.
We have bald-faced hornets, as well that are even MORE wicked than yellow-jackets.
I think they are pretty much opportunists and will make a nest almost anywhere possible if undisturbed. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellow_jacket

Yellowjackets have a lance-like stinger with small barbs and typically sting repeatedly,[1] though occasionally the sting becomes lodged and pulls free of the wasp's body; the venom, like most bee/wasp venoms, is primarily only dangerous to those who are allergic, unless a victim receives a large number of stings (main article: Bee sting). All species have yellow or white on the face. Mouthparts are well-developed for capturing and chewing insects, with a proboscis for sucking nectar, fruit, and other juices. Nests are built in trees, shrubs, or in protected places such as inside human-made structures (attics, hollow walls or flooring, in sheds, under porches, and eaves of houses), or in soil cavities, mouse burrows, etc. Nests are made from wood fiber chewed into a paper-like pulp.
Due to their aggressive behavior, including stinging, many other insects exhibit mimicry of yellowjackets; in addition to numerous bees and wasps (Müllerian mimicry), the list includes some flies, moths, and beetles (Batesian mimicry).

Yellowjackets' closest relatives, the hornets, closely resemble them but have a much bigger head, seen especially in the large distance from the eyes to the back of the head

[Ray Moscow]

If the usual sprays don't work, or if you can't get close enough to just douse the nest with gasoline, I'd call an exterminator.

[Jobar]

Interesting study on area eradication of German yellowjackets in the southern hemisphere:
http://www.inta.gov.ar/bariloche/ssd/nqn/ecologiadeinsectos/pdfs/Sackmann%20et%20al%202001.pdf

From that Wiki article:
* Dolichovespula species (for example the aerial yellowjacket Dolichovespula arenaria and the bald-faced hornet, Dolichovespula maculata) tend to create exposed aerial nests (a feature shared with true hornets, which has led to some confusion as to the use of the name "hornet").
* Vespula species, in contrast, build concealed nests, usually underground.

[Laton]

Interesting thread.

We have been hearing about European Wasps for a few years now but its only been in the last two that I've seen them around my place. I have a small shrub out the front that seems to be attracting them. Its getting sprayed & removed over the next month.

We do occasionally get Jack Jumpers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Jumper) Nasty little buggers.

"In individuals allergic to the venom (about 3% of cases), a sting sometimes causes anaphylactic shock. Although 3% may seem small, jack jumper ants cause more deaths in Tasmania than spiders, snakes, wasps, and sharks combined."

Petrol works wonders on their nests.

[crazyfingers]

Here is a photo of that second nest. Someone has really taken a chomp out of it. (A skunk?) After taking a better look, the chomp is out of the bottom.

I got a glimpse of several of the buggers. I saw some yellow jackets but I also saw black ones with white down by the stinger. If you look closely at the bottom left of the hive you'll see one of the black and white ones.

Assuming that this is the hive of the black and white ones, would yellow jackets invade the hive to steal larva??? I saw about as many yellow jackets around this as the black and white ones!

And there was not a lot of traffic. Standing there about 2 minutes about 5 feet away I saw only maybe 10 buggers in total at 6 pm with the sun still shining.


http://home.comcast.net/~mjdude/pwpimages/IMG_1693b%283%29.jpg

The part that's on the ground.

http://home.comcast.net/~mjdude/pwpimages/IMG_1692a%281%29.jpg

I wonder. Would they abandon the nest with that damage or try to repair it, particularly if yellow jackets are stealing the larva?

It's becoming a real drama!

[Jobar]

That's a hornet's nest. (Well, bald-faced hornets (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bald-faced_hornet) are related to wasps, and not a "true" hornet; but as the Wiki article says, everyone calls 'em hornets.)

Growing up on my family's dairy farm, in summer and fall we'd get numbers of these which would hunt the abundant flies.

I expect that nest was torn up by a skunk or armadillo. Not many other animals will intentionally mess with a hornet's nest. I'd be interested to watch the interaction between them and the yellowjackets you're seeing around that nest; can't say I've ever seen it happen, but I expect there'd be quite a battle!

[BWE]

a can of wd-40 and a lighter will do the trick re: the op. :)

[crazyfingers]

Just took a quick look at it this morning. It was attacked again over night. Much of the lower right of the nest in the photo above is now gone. There is still minimal activity.

[Goldie]

The critter must be after the larva.
I've opened up nests and looked at the larva before. It's interesting that you'll find them at all stages inside the cells.

I've never heard of the bald-faced and the yellow jackets co-existing... but if they are all the same basic breed, who knows?
They might be moving out due to the attacks. I have also witnessed yellow jackets moving into an old, abandond nest.
Chuck had several nests that he had plugged off in the woods, and once activity ceased he brought them home, still attached to the branch. They can be worth alot of money. They hung in our shop for 9 yrs.
When we had the shop fire, we placed the nests outside under a large carport along the shop. That summer yellow jackets made one their home. It was basket-ball sized and very FULL. I walked by it after shutting the shop door and heard the loud HUMMMMMMMMMMMMM.
I called Chuck. He was out of state. We had no Bee Bop and we were 30 miles from any place that sold it, so he told me to grab a can of break fluid out of the shop, spray it in the hole and "don't stop until they do."
I saturated the entire nest...which was probably over-kill... ruined the nest.
I broke it open the next day. In no time they had that huge nest full up with their coloney.

I've also watched wasps build mud nests. That's interesting. If you open those nests you'll find perfect, paralyzed spiders, waiting for the young to emerge and eat them.
The insect world to so fascinating.

[diana]

Those sound like dirt daubers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dirt_daubers), Goldie. They are your friends.

d

[Jobar]

Those sound like dirt daubers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dirt_daubers), Goldie. They are your friends.

d

Unless they build their nests inside an engine you're rebuilding, in which case they are not your friends. ;) I know this from experience!

Some varieties of wasps, such as dirt daubers, are quite peaceable, though. Even if you destroy their nests, they won't attack you, but will flee. You have to step on them barefooted, or crush them in your hand, before they'll sting- but they *will* sting, under those conditions.

Crazyfingers, I suspect you have an armadillo coming for the larvae in that nest. If it was a skunk, you'd probably be in no doubt, because you'd smell it!

Have you done anything about the smaller hole you found? It may be that the yellowjackets you see around the hornet's nest are scouts, looking for a place to move their colony, since you poisoned their old one; if that's the case you should deal with that small hole ASAP. I still say gasoline is your best bet. Spray carb cleaner works well too, as the fumes from any petroleum distillates will kill or stun insects which breathe through their skin. (Goldie, if you ever want to kill a nest without destroying it, carb cleaner or gasoline will do it. Just soak the outside, then leave it to dry out before you move the nest.)

[crazyfingers]

Crazyfingers, I suspect you have an armadillo coming for the larvae in that nest. If it was a skunk, you'd probably be in no doubt, because you'd smell it!

I have never seen an armadilo around here but that doen't rule them out. As for skunks, we do have then around. I see them frequently and usually I don't get a smell. Had one cute one in the garage a few years ago. He was in there at night when I went in. I talked softly to it and it made its way out. I love skunks. They are so cute.



Have you done anything about the smaller hole you found? It may be that the yellowjackets you see around the hornet's nest are scouts, looking for a place to move their colony, since you poisoned their old one; if that's the case you should deal with that small hole ASAP. I still say gasoline is your best bet. Spray carb cleaner works well too, as the fumes from any petroleum distillates will kill or stun insects which breathe through their skin. (Goldie, if you ever want to kill a nest without destroying it, carb cleaner or gasoline will do it. Just soak the outside, then leave it to dry out before you move the nest.)


I haven't done anything yet. But the hole is so close to the house I resist using something explosive like gasoline. In any case it's raining right now (vacation delayed). If it mainly stops tonight, if if we don't decide to leave on vacation this evening, I may go spray the hole and put a rock on it.

[Jobar]

Oh yeah, you're probably right. I don't think that armadillos have ranged that far north. (They're a real nuisance around here; the only good thing about them is that they will tear up a fire ant bed to eat the eggs and larvae. The only natural predator of fire ants in N. America, I understand.)

[crazyfingers]

Well the once-tropical storm has left us and there is only drizzle. About 50F degrees out.

So I went under the deck in my bug suit and strayed a can of wasp and hornet killer into the back door of the yellow jacket net and then shoved a rock into the hole.

Then I took another can of foaming wasp and hornet killer and sprayed the hornet nest in the Rotos. First I saturated the large damaged opening on the bottom and then I used the rest of the can on the outside of the nest. Of course it's soaking wet from the rain. I hope that the insecticide permeates the whole thing.

I never saw a single wasp or hornet either time.

Tomorrow, very early, we are off for vacation to Maine for a week. Be back late on Labor Day, Sept 7th.

[Jobar]

I recall once, in February, I was clearing out a stack of firewood which had rotted, for a customer. It was above freezing, but only just.

When I got to the last course of wood- the one lying on the ground- I picked up a log and under it was a yellowjacket nest. I had time to see it and flee before they could get airborne, in the cold. Good thing too, as it was a BIG one- hundreds of yellowjackets. If I'd done that in warmer weather I'd have been hurtin' for certain...

[Goldie]

I have never seen an armadilo around here but that doen't rule them out. As for skunks, we do have then around. I see them frequently and usually I don't get a smell. Had one cute one in the garage a few years ago. He was in there at night when I went in. I talked softly to it and it made its way out. I love skunks. They are so cute.

I had a pet skunk years ago. They are precious. She was a sweetheart. But, I've seen what they do to chickens. It's a bloody slaughter like no other.
But yea...they are cute. So are weasles... til they get into the hen-house.

[crazyfingers]

Postscript: In the week that I was a way the hornet nest in the rotos has been torn to shreds. I hope that a skunk didn't get sick.

I see no activity from the yellow jacket nest. No 3rd hole has appeared and holes 1 and 2 remain plugged.

[Goldie]

YOU DID IT! :D